Matchday pricing….

[POowl]

2 minutes ago, Andyben said:

Why is it selfish to point out he'd have saved a fortune buying earlier in the sale phase and spreading it over a monthly interest free payment plan. 

I'd have thought it was quite the opposite 

They were on sale with no notice, on sale for about a week, and a month after Christmas and you think that's right?

And it was looking like almost certainly going to be L1 football.

And where was the interest free payment plan? All I saw was cash or PayPal. And even if there was one no everyone can get credit

[bazapeps]

7 minutes ago, Andyben said:

Why is it selfish to point out he'd have saved a fortune buying earlier in the sale phase and spreading it over a monthly interest free payment plan. 

I'd have thought it was quite the opposite 

It's not even the point anyway. I've said throughout that i'd have bought one over the summer if the pricing was reasonable. I won't lose sleep over it. There's plenty of people that can afford but choose not too simply because of the principle of it. I maintain that the phase 1 prices, are more reasonable (certainly not cheap compared to most other clubs) but more palatable.  My main frustration, as previously mentioned is the later phasing prices, especially over the summer. 

[bazapeps]

7 minutes ago, Andyben said:

Why is it selfish to point out he'd have saved a fortune buying earlier in the sale phase and spreading it over a monthly interest free payment plan. 

I'd have thought it was quite the opposite 

It's not even the point anyway. I've said throughout that i'd have bought one over the summer if the pricing was reasonable. I won't lose sleep over it. There's plenty of people that can afford but choose not too simply because of the principle of it. I maintain that the phase 1 prices, are more reasonable (certainly not cheap compared to most other clubs) but more palatable.  My main frustration, as previously mentioned is the later phasing prices, especially over the summer. 

[bazapeps]

11 minutes ago, Andyben said:

Why is it selfish to point out he'd have saved a fortune buying earlier in the sale phase and spreading it over a monthly interest free payment plan. 

I'd have thought it was quite the opposite 

It's not even the point anyway. I've said throughout that i'd have bought one over the summer if the pricing was reasonable. I won't lose sleep over it. There's plenty of people that can afford but choose not too simply because of the principle of it. I maintain that the phase 1 prices, are more reasonable (certainly not cheap compared to most other clubs) but more palatable.  My main frustration, as previously mentioned is the later phasing prices, especially over the summer. 

[bazapeps]

2 minutes ago, POowl said:

They were on sale with no notice, on sale for about a week, and a month after Christmas and you think that's right?

And it was looking like almost certainly going to be L1 football.

And where was the interest free payment plan? All I saw was cash or PayPal. And even if there was one no everyone can get credit

There's an element of that type of thing too that comes across, as though if you don't plan and buy one in phase 1 that you're not really a proper fan, that you subsequently get what you deserve etc. I don't get that tbh. As a club and fan base surely we should be more welcoming to fellow fans and potential fans. People have changes in finances, in circumstances or simply decide at a later time that they quite fancy a season ticket. They should be made welcome, not criticised and ripped off by the club.

[mkowl]

@bazapepsGenuine questions 

1) Where is the additional revenue coming from. From what I see of a lot of the Wednesday fan base they will happily purchase a knock off home kit, they will get to the stadium 5 minutes before kick off "cus ales cheaper elsewhere". The Club could perhaps improve the commercial offerings elsewhere in the stadium but would there be any point if there is no take up. And lets not forget the measure here is profit not turnover 

2) Where are the magical cost savings coming from, I would hazard a guess that 80% of that is player and coaching related wages. Don't mention the stadium rent as that is a paper exercise cash wise 

 

[POowl]

9 minutes ago, mkowl said:

@bazapepsGenuine questions 

1) Where is the additional revenue coming from. From what I see of a lot of the Wednesday fan base they will happily purchase a knock off home kit, they will get to the stadium 5 minutes before kick off "cus ales cheaper elsewhere". The Club could perhaps improve the commercial offerings elsewhere in the stadium but would there be any point if there is no take up. And lets not forget the measure here is profit not turnover 

2) Where are the magical cost savings coming from, I would hazard a guess that 80% of that is player and coaching related wages. Don't mention the stadium rent as that is a paper exercise cash wise 

Where does other clubs revenue come from?

Did any other club put early bird tickets out in January for about a week?

[Andyben]

18 minutes ago, bazapeps said:

The comparisons to other clubs? I'd looked at them before. But after your post, had a look again at the first one you mentioned (Bristol City), saw they are lower than us, as I thought and so thought what is the point in even responding again. Agree Middlesbrough prices are high this season; though recall the owner did take some feedback onboard and make some reductions to certain areas. 

I've mentioned no such thing.

What I will say is that there appears to be a clamour from the Stir and Staton to quite our highest possible prices at the  most expensive time as indicative of how expensive Wednesday is, which is unfair.

Do you agree that Ty's example of th costs to buy an ST in real.life is more than reasonable?

[bazapeps]

25 minutes ago, Andyben said:

I've mentioned no such thing.

What I will say is that there appears to be a clamour from the Stir and Staton to quite our highest possible prices at the  most expensive time as indicative of how expensive Wednesday is, which is unfair.

Do you agree that Ty's example of th costs to buy an ST in real.life is more than reasonable?

I've mentioned no such thing.

If I mixed you up with another poster again then I apologise. It can be hard to follow. 

What I will say is that there appears to be a clamour from the Stir and Staton to quite our highest possible prices at the  most expensive time as indicative of how expensive Wednesday is, which is unfair.

At time I agree with that - there is at times too much of a focus on the most expensive. In the grand scheme of things, I don't consider that to be the underlying problem mind. 

Do you agree that Ty's example of th costs to buy an ST in real.life is more than reasonable?

Sorry not quite following the question

[bazapeps]

39 minutes ago, mkowl said:

@bazapepsGenuine questions 

1) Where is the additional revenue coming from. From what I see of a lot of the Wednesday fan base they will happily purchase a knock off home kit, they will get to the stadium 5 minutes before kick off "cus ales cheaper elsewhere". The Club could perhaps improve the commercial offerings elsewhere in the stadium but would there be any point if there is no take up. And lets not forget the measure here is profit not turnover 

2) Where are the magical cost savings coming from, I would hazard a guess that 80% of that is player and coaching related wages. Don't mention the stadium rent as that is a paper exercise cash wise 

 

Reasonable questions and MK in fairness I like that you are able to have a discussion and be a decent person, despite us clearly having different views. 

1. It may sound like a lazy answer but it's not down to me to work that out. When the owner is coming and telling fans to ask other clubs how the manage it cheaper, that to me at least shows a level of incompetence and makes it impossible to have confidence that he's running the financial side of things efficiently. Many clubs at our level, would love the size of fan base that we have and the income that derives.  I'll maintain that it shouldn't be down to the fans to pay excessive prices to plug the gap and the arguably failings off the pitch. Many of the areas where we've wasted money / not capitalised on income, have been discussed on here multiple times before, so no need for that detail again. 

2. Costs savings point essentially links into point 1, which is really just managing your income and expenditure. Ultimately all clubs at this level have a shortfall plugged by the owner, well the majority at least.

 

Couple of questions from me - 

1. Do you think the season ticket prices over the summer are reasonable? Should we make more effort to attract new season ticket holders?

2. Should we be charged more than the majority of other fans at this level?

3. Do you think it would help if we were more productive and welcoming in the season ticket advertisements etc - an attempt to make the fans seem wanted and appreciated? If the Owner maybe said he appreciates that tickets are on the high side but gave some explanation as to why he feels that's necessary?

[mkowl]

43 minutes ago, POowl said:

54 minutes ago, mkowl said:

@bazapepsGenuine questions 

1) Where is the additional revenue coming from. From what I see of a lot of the Wednesday fan base they will happily purchase a knock off home kit, they will get to the stadium 5 minutes before kick off "cus ales cheaper elsewhere". The Club could perhaps improve the commercial offerings elsewhere in the stadium but would there be any point if there is no take up. And lets not forget the measure here is profit not turnover 

2) Where are the magical cost savings coming from, I would hazard a guess that 80% of that is player and coaching related wages. Don't mention the stadium rent as that is a paper exercise cash wise 

Where does other clubs revenue come from?

Did any other club put early bird tickets out in January for about a week?

Do any other posters not know how to quote properly 

I have indicated on here that is too early and not for long enough period, but I presume the answer is cash flow

(lets not forget who first did this (ans Lee Strafford))

 

[Andyben]

34 minutes ago, bazapeps said:

Do you agree that Ty's example of th costs to buy an ST in real.life is more than reasonable?

Sorry not quite following the question

Ty posted that he renewed at first opportunity and spread it over several months by Dirct debit.

The monthly cost for the ST is equivalent to one Cat D game per month.

Doesn't that seem a very reasonable way to pay for an ST and quite cheap?

Remember this was available to EVERY Wednesday fan at th time

[mkowl]

6 minutes ago, bazapeps said:

Reasonable questions and MK in fairness I like that you are able to have a discussion and be a decent person, despite us clearly having different views. 

1. It may sound like a lazy answer but it's not down to me to work that out. When the owner is coming and telling fans to ask other clubs how the manage it cheaper, that to me at least shows a level of incompetence and makes it impossible to have confidence that he's running the financial side of things efficiently. Many clubs at our level, would love the size of fan base that we have and the income that derives.  I'll maintain that it shouldn't be down to the fans to pay excessive prices to plug the gap and the arguably failings off the pitch. Many of the areas where we've wasted money / not capitalised on income, have been discussed on here multiple times before, so no need for that detail again. 

2. Costs savings point essentially links into point 1, which is really just managing your income and expenditure. Ultimately all clubs at this level have a shortfall plugged by the owner, well the majority at least.

 

Couple of questions from me - 

1. Do you think the season ticket prices over the summer are reasonable? Should we make more effort to attract new season ticket holders?

2. Should we be charged more than the majority of other fans at this level?

3. Do you think it would help if we were more productive and welcoming in the season ticket advertisements etc - an attempt to make the fans seem wanted and appreciated? If the Owner maybe said he appreciates that tickets are on the high side but gave some explanation as to why he feels that's necessary?

1) I think there has to be a degree of stick and carrot. The reason for the early bird timing is 95% certainty due to cash flow management. If you knew the price in the summer was going to be similar then guess what you would wait. It would be interesting to review historically when there were 2 may be 3 phases what the percentage uplift was on each. 

I have expressed the view in that I don't think there is a huge pool of untapped wannabee season ticket holders out there. A £100 price drop would need 5000 new season ticket holder to be revenue neutral.

So why make a lot of effort if the return is minimal 

2) The choice is to buy a season ticket or not, if the perception is of being over charged then do not buy one. But lets be clear Chansiri is not making a profit here, puts in £xm whether by sponsorship or simply loans. The pricing is probably a requirement of that function and to make the Club competitive on the pitch. 

3) I think Chansiri saying as little as possible in the public domain is my preferred stance 

[bazapeps]

9 minutes ago, Andyben said:

Ty posted that he renewed at first opportunity and spread it over several months by Dirct debit.

The monthly cost for the ST is equivalent to one Cat D game per month.

Doesn't that seem a very reasonable way to pay for an ST and quite cheap?

Remember this was available to EVERY Wednesday fan at th time

A perfectly reasonable method of planning and saving, no problem. But how he budgets or finances isn't the issue in question. That's more about the actual prices versus our competitors. In particular our later phase prices and those over the summer period. A comparison and breakdown versus our MD prices (which are awful in themselves) isn't for a me a fair or relevant comparison. 

[Andyben]

14 minutes ago, bazapeps said:

A perfectly reasonable method of planning and saving, no problem. But how he budgets or finances isn't the issue in question. That's more about the actual prices versus our competitors. In particular our later phase prices and those over the summer period. A comparison and breakdown versus our MD prices (which are awful in themselves) isn't for a me a fair or relevant comparison. 

There you go. Comparing our prices at the most expensive to our competitors.

Why not compare them at the cheapest time and at the least expensive method.

 

[Andyben]

15 minutes ago, bazapeps said:

A perfectly reasonable method of planning and saving, no problem. But how he budgets or finances isn't the issue in question. That's more about the actual prices versus our competitors. In particular our later phase prices and those over the summer period. A comparison and breakdown versus our MD prices (which are awful in themselves) isn't for a me a fair or relevant comparison. 

Who are our competitors.

Have you priced the cost now for similar ground locations compared to ours?

[fOWLmouth]

1 hour ago, POowl said:

 

 

 

This obviously. But you knew that anyways.

So I’m a selfish knob for pointing out how the economy works in a capitalist system.Where did I say I liked it.I may be a millionaire and love the system,I may be a socialist,anarchist,communist,you tell me,you seem to know. What’s your answer to it all?Perhaps we shouldn’t pay anything to watch a game until after the final whistle.Then we could contribute what we think it was worth.

[mkowl]

23 minutes ago, fOWLmouth said:

So I’m a selfish knob for pointing out how the economy works in a capitalist system.Where did I say I liked it.I may be a millionaire and love the system,I may be a socialist,anarchist,communist,you tell me,you seem to know. What’s your answer to it all?Perhaps we shouldn’t pay anything to watch a game until after the final whistle.Then we could contribute what we think it was worth.

Wednesday 5 Barcelona 0

Champions League Semi 2034

Tyler from Walkley puts in 2 Euros 

[Hirstys 12th Pint]

4 hours ago, bazapeps said:

My bad it was Tylluan, not yourself. When you replied to my response wrongly assumed it must have the same person originally. 

Please don't use the term 'my bad'  - that's as bad as the anti DC narrative.

[Tylluan]

5 hours ago, bazapeps said:

1 Are you seriously trying to suggest that our ticket prices are so high to avoid FFP sanctions? Come one. Sorry but even if that was true, ripping off fans surely isn't the right way to go about that. It's up to the owner to manage income and expenses and budget accordingly. FFP is there for all clubs and not all clubs feel a need to rip fans off. 2Granted DC will always make up some of the shortfall, like the majority of the clubs do. If he isn't happy doing that he's free to sell up and move on, he's not forced too. 

Like i've said before; 3if we knew DC had his hands tied and was doing literally everything possible to improve revenue and save costs, then STs prices would be more acceptance. But historically we know that's not the case. 4He could even word the ticket release statements to indicate that, explain that he sympathises with fans, that's he's doing everything possible and wants everyone to be in it together etc etc. That would make it far more pallatable. Instead it's a like it or lump it approach and more evidence 5he couldn't give a toss about the average SWFC fan. 

1. What I said was the club has to show it's generating it's own revenue in relation to it's spending. But please feel free to misread, misquote, and over sensationalise to get your own point across. 

2. Under Championship P&S rules a club is allowed to make a loss of £5m. It's not £13m a year or £39m over 3 years and never had been. The £13m comes from the owner being allowed to put a maximum of £8m a year in to cover shortfall (not including covering general operating costs) an owner only puts in £2m and the club can only lose £7m

3. There may be some sane fans amongst us, you included seeing as you've written it, that would appreciate some honesty regarding the state of DC's piggy bank if any were needed but the club's finances are there for all to see in the year's accounts. 

4. Can you imagine what would happen if Chansiri made a statement that said his wallet was becoming empty so we were all going to have to dip further into ours but he sympathised about it. That's like Sunak saying he didn't have Sky tv as a kid. 

5. There are the 18000 fans (out of an average 23k home end attendance last season) who've bought a season ticket and, according to you, this also includes members of 1867. They're supporting the club, not Chansiri.

According to mk's calculations these sales would generate £8.1m pre tax. You could say that Chansiri match funds that amount with his £8m. 

That's 18000 fans and one owner generating £16m. I think that's fair. 

We have the best manager in some fans lifetime but that comes with a cost. Those costs will have been factored as early as the middle of November when Danny would have handed in his January wish list and also what he thought he needed in June. Not just players but infrastructure upgrades that would keep him. 

We could have lower prices and just kept Tyreeq Bakinson and Ashley Fletcher, possibly losing Rohl in the process. 1867's got to keep him rhetoric comes at a price so they can't have it both ways. 

Or we could just debt the club to death like other championship clubs are. 

Edited July 11 by Tylluan

[Otto_Man]

I still can't fathom how all this comes as a surprise to some people. We had all these same conversations last year because exactly the same thing happened then.

Let's be honest with ourselves here, some folks decided to wait and see what division we were in before committing, absolutely your choice. Some of us didn't and you have to remember that in January the chances of the 24/25 season being played in L1 were a lot greater and so season tickets were priced accordingly.

[Otto_Man]

Oh and it's £513 for a season ticket on the kop at the grunters if that helps anyone

[mkowl]

1 hour ago, Otto_Man said:

Oh and it's £513 for a season ticket on the kop at the grunters if that helps anyone

Presumably that is what I receive - sorry not enough

[Andyben]

1 hour ago, Otto_Man said:

Oh and it's £513 for a season ticket on the kop at the grunters if that helps anyone

...and the square root of fuck all of that £513 makes it to the club - all pledged to MacQuarie Bank 

[Andyben]

Have they gone now?

[fOWLmouth]

5 minutes ago, Andyben said:

Have they gone now?

Looks like it 👍

[Bellsview]

7 hours ago, POowl said:

 

 

 

This obviously. But you knew that anyways.

So we didn’t sell out at Wembley with next to no time for ‘part-time’ supporters to find hundreds of pounds of cash then?

And we won’t sell our full allocation v The Pigs this season then, despite it more than likely being a Category A game in terms of price banding?

If you’re quoting me to try and prove some I’ll-informed point about POTG supporters, you’ve just made a total prick of yourself.

But you knew that anyways! 

[Skamp]

I think I preferred it when the Indians did a dawn raid on the site than these Stalkers spouting their ill-informed, anti DC tosh.

[Billysboy]

3 hours ago, Andyben said:

Have they gone now?

Beddy byes 😴

[Theman]

Does anyone here think DC is in this to take a profit out of the club, that he is doing anything but subsidising within the rules, as much as he can, he is ripping off no-one but himself 👍

[mkowl]

7 hours ago, Theman said:

Does anyone here think DC is in this to take a profit out of the club, that he is doing anything but subsidising within the rules, as much as he can, he is ripping off no-one but himself 👍

The only profit he could make at this point is to get promoted into the Premier League.

Aside from the 5% probability of that happening, the reality is each pound put in is a sunk cost. 

What nobody knows is the availability of continued funding, the level thereof and the inclination of him to keep spending it.

My continued gripe with the 1867 mob is the presumption the Club could easily be sold and there is a queue of potential suitors waiting in the wings that have the requisite funds 

[Owling_Wolf]

1 hour ago, mkowl said:

The only profit he could make at this point is to get promoted into the Premier League.

Aside from the 5% probability of that happening, the reality is each pound put in is a sunk cost. 

What nobody knows is the availability of continued funding, the level thereof and the inclination of him to keep spending it.

My continued gripe with the 1867 mob is the presumption the Club could easily be sold and there is a queue of potential suitors waiting in the wings that have the requisite funds 

Aka Jam Tomorrow.

[BraddersTim]

14 hours ago, Skamp said:

I think I preferred it when the Indians did a dawn raid on the site than these Stalkers spouting their ill-informed, anti DC tosh.

I  preferred the Blackpool fans, at least they were a laugh.

[Reesh]

12 hours ago, Billysboy said:

Beddy byes 😴

Nah job club had finished so they lost computer access 

[Reesh]

I've got one for the anti DC brigade who make the claims we'd sell a huge amount more STs if it was cheaper, what is the basis?

As I've got a rough estimate of our ST sales for around 30-35 years and even in the good times we don't tend to break a 20k barrier so that seems a deep seated mentality amongst the fanbase.

Edited July 12 by Reesh

[mkowl]

2 hours ago, Reesh said:

I've got one for the anti DC brigade who make the claims we'd sell a huge amount more STs if it was cheaper, what is the basis?

As I've got a rough estimate of our ST sales for around 30-35 years and even in the good times we don't tend to break a 20k barrier so that seems a deep seated mentality amongst the fanbase.

Even back to the 80s and indeed 90s the swing in attendances from home game to home game was large. You could get 30k plus for a midweek game v the likes of Everton and 15 k for the Saturday for West Ham

I always recall getting to the FA Cup Semi in 1983 and how suddenly half my school year were Wednesday fans that I had never seen at games before

So a vast number of our fan base are never going to commit. 

Though having joined that breed I can hardly say owt - but its pertinent to the potential season ticket number 

[Andyben]

No way we'd see a 30% uptake in season tickets if the club charged a little less.

None.

Anyway. No point talking about this until we lose a few games and the cretins reappear 

[Andyben]

On 11/07/2024 at 13:07, POowl said:

They were on sale with no notice, on sale for about a week, and a month after Christmas and you think that's right?

Was exactly the same as previous 3/4 seasons s not a surprise at all.

On 11/07/2024 at 13:07, POowl said:

And it was looking like almost certainly going to be L1 footbal

Which matters because? In fact it makes more sense to renew early as it's cheaper then...

On 11/07/2024 at 13:07, POowl said:

And where was the interest free payment plan? All I saw was cash or PayPal. And even if there was one no everyone can get credit

It should appear when you are at th checkout. 

[Reesh]

Warning : Contains PORK

[Otto_Man]

1 hour ago, Reesh said:

Warning : Contains PORK

So basically if you go to more than 10 games, our potg prices are cheaper? Less games if you take advantage of the 4(?) double discounted games

[Reesh]

He's a POOR little HAMMER

[Owling_Wolf]

48 minutes ago, Reesh said:

He's a POOR little HAMMER

🤯

[Owling_Wolf]

Just now, Owling_Wolf said:

🤯

'How to buy.'

First, rob a bank...

[Beaconowl]

2 hours ago, Reesh said:

He's a POOR little HAMMER

WOW!!!! 😮

[bradowl]

Some very expensive prices for those that pay game by game next season. 

Here's another... 

[bradowl]

On 23/07/2024 at 11:30, Reesh said:

Warning : Contains PORK

Our kids tickets are cheaper.  Little uns (junior pig) £12 to £24 whilst its only £5 at S6. 

[Andyben]

2 minutes ago, bradowl said:

Our kids tickets are cheaper.  Little uns (junior pig) £12 to £24 whilst its only £5 at S6. 

I remember reading that in the St.....err hang on.